Hourly cost of whatever it is we’re doing in Libya: about $4 million. Total cost of building one mile of border fence, as undertaken by our horribly inefficient, bloated, largely incompetent federal government: about $2 million. So, every 30 minutes we’re in Libya is one mile of border fence we could have built: Assuming the mission is accomplished in each case, which investment would make us safer?
I hasten to remind all that Qaddafi isn’t just a cornered rat, but a cornered-rat terrorist. And if some Mohammed al-Kaboom in his employ were inclined to walk into the United States with a suitcase dirty bomb or bioweapon, and take a quick drive to our nation’s second-largest city or our fourth-largest city, he’d probably find very little standing in his way, because we refuse to make the most elementary sort of commitment to our own national security.
My own theory for why we haven’t had terrorist spectaculars launched across the U.S. Mexico border: Even al-Qaeda is afraid of Juarez these days.
BHO wants to organize the Libyan community.
Reply to this commentLinkReport Abuse"My own theory for why we haven’t had terrorist spectaculars launched across the U.S. Mexico border: Even al-Qaeda is afraid of Juarez these days."
Related: the strip clubs there are probably too dangerous for al-Qaeda to enjoy.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseMy theory supported much more strongly with the facts on the ground: We did a bang-up job attracting terrorists to throw themselves against our main battle tanks way over there until abt two years ago. For that W, Rummy and others - for all their manifold faults - stand in stark contrast to today's bozos. Anyone who thinks we can stop them on our border with Mex needs to see our border with CA - or walk our shoreline. ALL the stripped down streamlined Armed Forces on earth pressed into posse comitatus can't defend that. What a pipe dream: those who wanna defend our nation from here with a skeletal crew.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseA more likely possibility: Mexico is willing to help keep the Muslim terrorists out so that its own invasion can proceed according to schedule.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseI'm always skeptical when I see "what it costs" estimates as they relate to the use of force by American military assets.
Is this estimate measuring the additional cost of operations, beyond what would normally be spent on any other day for those military assets?
Even the cruise-missiles that were used don't have unending useful lives. It's very much a "use it or lose it" asset. IOW, if you don't drop them on a target, eventually you have to destroy them.
I'm not saying there aren't additional costs. Clearly there are. But, I would want to be absolutely sure that I'm accurately counting what those real additional costs are.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseThe longer that no serious action is taken to staunch the flow of illegal immigrants into the US, the more I am convinced that Congress' unwillingness to secure the border must stem from something deeper than Democrats' desire for votes from illiterate, uneducated welfare recipients from Mexico and Republicans' fear of taking away the illegal profits of the agro businesses and small-time, sleazy restaurant and landscaping business owners.
There are 15 million illegals from Mexico, and yet you see more on the news about the way that jobs are found and indentured servitude demanded of the relatively tiny number of illegal immigrants from China. It's clear that restaurants that hire exclusively illegals (how's that for equal opportunity!) are not simply hiring people off the street, but are the end users of a sophisticated illegal labor market where coyotes and cartels send workers to restaurants in need of illegal labor. The fact that Congress doesn't seem to have ever investigated this, or the media to have covered it, leads one to wonder what sort of high-placed individuals know about, and fear imperiling, that system.
At the end of the day, it would be so easy, and so cheap, to build a fence, to mandate E-Verify, and to bust the illegal labor markets. Congress does none of this for a reason, and that reason, whatever it is, is a slap in the face of every American.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseIf our movers and shakers really wanted to protect American working people, they would not invite a flood of illegals in. They evidently "need" to have a large group of easily dominated supporters and/or peons at their disposal. But seeing as that terrorists are not so easily dominated, I wonder why they let them in, too. Maybe that's considered to be of minor importance in view of the great "need".
Since this whole business is anti-constitutional, I would hope the Tea Party would give it a lot of opposition.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseI don't see it is a question of efficiency; as a question of the relative advantages of spending money on X *versus* Y. Rather to me it is the failure to do X (secure the borders) undermining the justification for doing Y (the Iraq & Afghan Wars, the Patriot Act, etc.).
George W. Bush tried to justify an awful lot of things by claiming they were necessary to secure this country from terrorism. One thing he never did, however, was ask his Chamber of Commerce pals to sacrifice one iota. Feeling up every 85-year-old grandmother from Tulsa was considered acceptable; disallowing the control of US ports by the government of Dubai was not; securing our borders against illegal immigration was not.
Shortly before the Iraq War began I seriously considered joining the National Guard with the understanding (the hope, even) that I might be deployed to a war zone. I calculated a significant financial cost for myself just for the training alone. But that isn't what stopped me. I wouyld've been happy to make such a sacrifice. What did stop me was the growing realization that I would be sacrificing financially and bodily for a country that the Bush/Neocon/Wall Street Urinal crowd no longer considered to be mine, but thought of as one giant Middle Eastern Bazaar. Bush's pre-9/11 attempt at amnesty had already upset me. Then, at the same time I was considering the Guard, I moved to an office that was around the corner from a medical clinic, subsidized by my insurer, that was primarily for the benefit of Hispanic illegals. Then, as a final straw, my car was totalled by an uninsured Mexican illegal.
When George W. Bush came into office his first major act was a tax cut that benefitted primarily the rich and that caused our deficit to soar, and his next major act would've been an amnesty for illegal immigrants - both were acts calculated to benefit big business and the wealthy . Thinking across 8 years of the miserable Bush II Era, there is not a single major initiative that social conservatives (religious or non-religious) can point to that Bush even tried to pass. Not one. I am done with such Republicans. I have and will vote for Democrats before I will vote for them.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseAnd FYI, even if the cost of a fence were $1,000 per foot, the sum total of a 2,000 mile border fence would still only be about $10.56 billion - or the money we give in 2 years to Israel and Egypt, spend in a year or so on PEPFAR, or spent in one month during the Iraq and Afghan Wars.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseWJ-Anger management son. You got issues. Lots of VN era draft ahem avoiders (Cheney, Lott, Gingrich among them) repent ever so mildly dodging the man-up test of their time. Don't fret over it, there were lots of young men - and women - who signed up in your stead.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseTypical misuse of financial minutae to suggest relationships where none exist.
Neither policy costs any substantial amount of money; either policy can be followed or not without any reference to the other; there is no real trade off between them. No one opposing work on the border even pretends the issue is monetary expense; and anyone pretending that their opposition to the actions in Libya are motivated by its economic cost is pretending. There aren't any.
Personally I support policing the border and intervention in Libya, which I do more robustly, in fact. Which neatly blows to smithereens the notion that there is any trade off between them.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseJasonC:
In a world of finite resources, all such decisions are tradeoffs.
Reply to this commentLinkReport Abuse>"No one opposing work on the border even pretends the issue is monetary expense"
According to Michael Chertoff, a wall running the length of the border would cost too much. How many other names do I need to dig up for you?
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseKevin, you need to talk to a fellow by the name of Mark Krikorian. He will tell you how a border fence would pay for itself many times over, in form of lower spending on Mediaid, public schools, prisons, and just about everything else. The reason it hasn't been built isn't cost.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseMr. Williamson,
With all due respect. Mr. Bernanke will be correcting your attempt to suggest that we have a FINITE amount of resources in this country. The checks in the mail?
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseI would like to see a fence with a mine field on our side of the border. Otherwise, a 10-foot fence is vulnerable to a 12-foot ladder. Some people won't take such boundary markers seriously until someone dies. Post it as a danger zone, of courses, in English, Spanish, and Arabic. I wish I could think of an alternative to killing people, but I can't -- someone else solve the ladder problem, please.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseCactus Bill brings it all home!
Reply to this commentLinkReport Abuserimfrel, mine fields are overkill. Singapore-style prison terms for illegal aliens and employers of such would work just fine as a deterrent measure. Here's the schedule of penalties:
"Illegal immigrants face penalties of up to six months in prison and three strokes of a rattan cane. Employers who hire illegal immigrants face two years in jail, fines of up to S$6,000 ($US1=S$1.6) and possible caning. In March 1998, judges reportedly increased the standard penalty on illegal immigrants to between four and six weeks imprisonment and between four and six strokes of the cane. The maximum penalty for entering Singapore illegally is six months jail and 12 strokes of the cane."
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseWhile I agree it would be nice to see better border security, I think you are assuming certain facts. First of all, the fact that extremists thus far have not launched an attack by entering from the southern border suggests that it may be more difficult than you posit. (and I am aware of the detainees currently in custody who attempted to enter who are from middle eastern countries of origin.) Mexico while not much help on issues of Latin American emigration, has cooperated with the United States on terrorists attempting to enter from abroad.
Furthermore, since we are talking about trade-offs with defense spending, we have to consider there has been no significant terrorist attacks (other than Ft. Hood committed by an American citizen/Army officer) since 9/11 on American soil. I would attribute this to the military's and intelligence branch's success in disrupting terror networks in AF/PAK, Iraq, Yemen, the Phillipines etc. While there is plenty of fat that can and should be cut from defense spending, I have no doubt that we are in a prolonged period of conflict with Islamic extremists that will require military engagements for the foreseeable future. It is a pipe dream that building a wall and enforcing immigration laws will protect us, not to mention our allies, business relationships, and the sea lanes. Countering terrorism will take patience and a comprehensive approach that includes both border security, traditional law enforcement, intelligence gathering, and yes, military action.
While I agree with you, making hard choices about our fiscal situation is long over-due, I also believe defending our country is a basic duty of government. Defense spending should be subjected to the same scrutiny as other spending, but it remains the most basic of government responsibilities.
Reply to this commentLinkReport AbuseTo Mr Williamson - Horsefeathers. Here is my "trade off" - fund a border fence, fund the military to any required extent, and give away less in unneeded gravy to ungrateful geezers before election day. Trade off solved. Not even hard...
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