Some interesting e-mails for late on a Saturday night. Here are a bunch, but I’ll hide most of ‘em behind one of those more links:

The Koran simply denies that Jesus of Nazareth is the Christ. This is an opinion that that greatly appealed to Voltaire and other figures of the Enlightenment., because they shared it. So you might consider this possibility: that the program will tell us more about the liberal view of Jesus than about the Muslim one. Next on the agenda: the Muslim view of Moses?

And:

Hi Jonah,
I’m certainly not an expert on the Muslim view of Jesus. I am a grad student of early Aramaic (and Coptic) Christianity though, and I have professors who *are* experts on early Muslim / Christian relations. I’ve picked up some relevant facts from them: I know enough to say that the blurb from the BBC is accurate as far as it goes. Certainly, Jesus is regarded as an important prophet. (And by the way, Mary is also regarded with great veneration–there’s a significant passage in the Quran dealing with her miraculous life growing up in the Temple of Jerusalem which was derived from Christian apocryphal stories.)
However, as for the idea that a documentary such as this would “shift the focus away from extremism to the spiritual side of Islam”, well, I don’t get how it would do that. It’s not as if the extremists don’t read the parts of the Quran talking about Jesus–the problem is that those parts of the Quran themselves are embedded with pointed assertions that Jesus is not the Son of God, and that it is terribly blasphemous to say that God had a son. Oh, and that the Christian scriptures are terribly corrupt, so that the Christian Jesus is really just a warped picture of what the true Jesus was. So there’s friction built into this topic right from the beginning — the very first words Islam has to say about Jesus are already flavored by Muslim / Christian controversy.
It’s not a small part of the controversy either, because the disagreements on Jesus cut to the very core of both religions. The Christian notion of Jesus being the Son of God cuts against the most central tenant of Islam: the absolutely unique, supreme and “other” nature of God with respect to anything else at all. That is, God can have no son, for a son is like a father and there is absolutely nobody like God.
On the other hand, for Christians, that Jesus is both Son of God and God Himself (true God and true man) is really a central, defining belief. In fact, many take that particular belief to be the litmus test of whether to call a particular religion “Christian” or not–this is why many Christians don’t think Mormons can be called “Christian”, because Mormons don’t believe that Christ is God.
It seems to me that topic of Jesus doesn’t look as much like a source of unity between Muslims and Christians, so much as a minefield of controversy. Certainly it was an early controversy and, arguably, the very first controversy between the two. So if this documentary doesn’t convey this friction to you (and I would not at all be surprised if it turned out to be a fuzzy-wuzzy “oooh, look how much we really have in common” thing), you should be aware that something big is being papered over.

And:

Jonah,
I think you need to lower your expectations for the upcoming BBC documentaty on how Muslims see Jesus.
Two huge warning signs from the Guardian quote:First:”Representatives from mainstream Anglican and Catholic organisations were invited to take part in the film, to be broadcast on Sunday, but nobody was available, Mr Ashraf said.”Huh? Nobody answers the phone at the Vatican? I guess Archie of Canterbury was hobnobbing with the Wiccans at Stonehedge again.Second:”I hope it will provoke among Muslims the feeling they are included in television.”I’m sure this is what those who want to revert back to the 7th century are dreaming about.I think your time will be better spent with an Ultraman DVD.

And, from my Middle East Guy:

Hey, Jonah,
What they elide there is that the crucifixion was only somewhat of an
illusion. It wasn’t Jesus on the cross, but Judas, whom God made to
look like Jesus for reasons best known to Himself. (Or for
psychological reason internal to a Prophet who couldn’t stand the idea
—or conceive of—a crucified previous Prophet.) Does that make God
look like a deceptive d**k? Yes, yes, it does.

And:

Jonah:
It’s possible to tell from the Koran that Mohammed, living in his time and place, was exposed only to a heretical version of Christianity known as Nestorianism. He, apparently, had no exposure to normative orthodox biblical Christianity. So, Islam’s view of Christianity has been skewed from the get-go. Since he never experienced the real thing, it was easy for Islam to come up with other views, shall we say, regarding the crucifixion, etc.
It’ll be interesting to read your review of that BBC film, if you choose to watch it.
Enjoy your vacation!

And:

Jonah,
Christians, well at least those well-informed, know that Islam respects
Jesus. The issue is who do they think he is. Which, basically and
curiously, puts them into the same sort of answer as Judaism. Nice guy,
good teacher, maybe even influential. But the Son of God or the
Messiah? Nope. And so they see Christians as heretics.
Judaism, however, at least can say they met the man and judged him
within his context. Islam is basically a lot more like Mormons. After
that many centuries they are just offering their opinions and views.
Nothing to commend it but for the fact they really say it’s true.
Kind of like Dan Rather, I suppose.
I could say all sorts of things about Henry V, for instance. But,
after six centuries, who really cares about what I say about him? Even
if I really believe what I have to say.
Given the context it arose, Islam can I think be considered a curious
mix of Christian and Jewish heresies. Both religions along with
paganism were known in the region and contributed theology and wording
to the nascent movement, as can be seen by how Islam appropriates the
Jewish narrative and tries to re-define the Christian. Something for
everyone! Join Islam.
It is nice to see this show, however. For to emphasis the spirituality
of Islam is a very, very powerful gesture. We have theological
distinctions, but a shared spirituality of sorts. To emphasize the
latter might help conversation, or at least lesson the tendency to
thrust a sword in the other.
Thanks for posting this. I bet it will be a very interesting
documentary, and in a way illustrate to Christians how Judaism feels
when a story is appropriated and used for a differing theology.
Thanks for the Saturday thought,

And:

Hi Jonah,
I’m certainly not an expert on the Muslim view of Jesus. I am a grad student of early Aramaic (and Coptic) Christianity though, and I have professors who are experts on early Muslim / Christian relations. I’ve picked up some relevant facts from them: I know enough to say that the blurb from the BBC is accurate as far as it goes. Certainly, Jesus is regarded as an important prophet. (And by the way, Mary is also regarded with great veneration–there’s a significant passage in the Quran dealing with her miraculous life growing up in the Temple of Jerusalem which was derived from Christian apocryphal stories.)
However, as for the idea that a documentary such as this would “shift the focus away from extremism to the spiritual side of Islam,” well, I don’t get how it would do that. It’s not as if the extremists don’t read the parts of the Quran talking about Jesus–the problem is that those parts of the Quran themselves are embedded with pointed assertions that Jesus is not the Son of God, and that it is terribly blasphemous to say that God had a son. Oh, and that the Christian scriptures are terribly corrupt, so that the Christian Jesus is really just a warped picture of what the true Jesus was. So there’s friction built into this topic right from the beginning — the very first words Islam has to say about Jesus are already flavored by Muslim / Christian controversy.
It’s not a small part of the controversy either, because the disagreements on Jesus cut to the very core of both religions. The Christian notion of Jesus being the Son of God cuts against the most central tenant of Islam: the absolutely unique, supreme and “other” nature of God with respect to anything else at all. That is, God can have no son, for a son is like a father and there is absolutely nobody like God.
On the other hand, for Christians, that Jesus is both Son of God and God Himself (true God and true man) is really a central, defining belief. In fact, many take that particular belief to be the litmus test of whether to call a particular religion “Christian” or not–this is why many Christians don’t think Mormons can be called “Christian”, because Mormons don’t believe that Christ is God.
It seems to me that topic of Jesus doesn’t look as much like a source of unity between Muslims and Christians, so much as a minefield of controversy. Certainly it was an early controversy and, arguably, the very first controversy between the two. So if this documentary doesn’t convey this friction to you (and I would not at all be surprised if it turned out to be a fuzzy-wuzzy “oooh, look how much we really have in common” thing), you should be aware that something big is being papered over.