Everyone seems to have thoughts about the Oval Office meeting heard ’round the world, and your Editors panelists are no exception.

One point of public contention has been Ukrainian President Zelensky’s choice of outfit for the meeting, but Andrew Stuttaford points out that we shouldn’t forget that “we have Churchill in his siren suit in the White House. You have Donald Trump with his baseball cap. I mean . . . everyone has their gimmick. I did not see that as disrespectful. And indeed, there’s a point in the meeting very early on when things were fairly amicable, when actually Trump and [Zelensky] sort of swapped a half joke about it.”

Asked about the tone of the meeting itself, Charlie says one observation is “that I just don’t want my president to behave like that. Now, I’ve heard it said, ‘He’s the president of the United States.’ Yeah, that works both ways. Act like it. We are not going to be directly affected if this all goes south for Ukraine. We are rich and powerful and better than everywhere else. And Donald Trump has the fortune to be in charge of the executive branch. And I think that that comes with certain obligations.

“So whether or not Zelensky was annoying, disrespectful, what you will, Donald Trump should have done what great statesmen do and say, ‘We’ll talk about this later.’ Yes, it is interesting to see this sort of thing in public. And yes, world leaders do shout at each other behind closed doors. But the reason for those doors being closed has been established for thousands of years.”

To hear Michael tackle the question of whether or not the confrontation was staged, and more, listen below.

The Editors podcast is recorded on Tuesdays and Fridays every week and is available wherever you listen to podcasts.